Is This the END or Just the BEGINNING? Geert Wilders charged over Fitna movie

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PLEASE NOTE: The content of this blog and opinions expressed here or pointed to are all my choice and mine alone. In particular, the controversial postings on the present Wilders/Islam issues implies NO reference whatsoever to Tony Blair’s opinions on Islam. (This note is a result of an e-mail I received from a well-respected online friend and commenter, expressing concern that the title of my blog [Tony Blair] might lead some to incorrect conclusions, or even to weaken Mr Blair’s position on interfaith dialogue. That is NOT, repeat NOT my intention or desire.)

Comment at end

21st January, 2009

Click to watch the Fitna movie here on this page.  Also, a CNN interview video with Wilders

About Geert Wilders.  Sign the petition IN DEFENCE OF GEERT WILDERS (and against his persecution/prosecution). Now almost 20,000 signatories, 24 Jan

List of sites/blogs which have taken a similar stand to my site on this seriously deteriorating situation for freedom in the west.  Please leave a message if you wish to be added, or even removed

  • You can also watch Geert Wilders’ video here at Google (while it’s still available). Compare THIS (mostly factual) information, with only some limited opinion, with the rantings of anti-western fundamentalist Islamicists (my differentiation of terms) promoted by such as Lauren Booth, the proud Gazan passport-holder. WE, who speak out against terror attacks by Islamicist terrorists are abused as ‘the REAL criminals’. But for pointing out the obvious – that Islamicist terrorists who in their own words link themselves to Islam are the REAL and PROVEN threat to the world, Wilders is about to be prosecuted.
  • Incomplete list of recent terror attacks (by Al Qaeda)

WHAT’S THE DIFFERENCE between radical Islamicists screaming abuse of The West and Wilders’ criticism? The difference is that Islam and all those who purport to speak in its name are now UNIQUELY protected by governments and laws.  By slow, steady brainwashing of the innocent such fundamentalists are permitted to undermine our western societies.  Meanwhile those of us who try to inform the world of this are vilified. And NOW prosecuted. An INCREDIBLE state of affairs!


SHAME, SHAME, SHAME ON US  – ‘FREE’ WESTERN PEOPLES – FOR ACCEPTING THIS LOSS OF OUR FREEDOM OF SPEECH

TODAY SUCH FREEDOMS ONLY BELONG TO THOSE WHO ABUSE THEM

THIS, MY FRIENDS, IS OUTRAGEOUS


BBC Report TODAY

Page last updated at 13:58 GMT, Wednesday, 21 January 2009

Dutch court has ordered prosecutors to put a right-wing politician on trial for making anti-Islamic statements.

geertwilders_tobecharged_underpoliceprotection

Geert Wilders, under threat of death as was the fate of Islam critic Theo Van Gogh, has been under Police protection since publishing his video "Fitna".

Freedom Party leader Geert Wilders made a controversial film last year equating Islam with violence and has likened the Koran to Adolf Hitler’s Mein Kampf.

“In a democratic system, hate speech is considered so serious that it is in the general interest to… draw a clear line,” the court in Amsterdam said.

Mr Wilders said the judgement was an “attack on the freedom of expression”.

“Participation in the public debate has become a dangerous activity. If you give your opinion, you risk being prosecuted,” he said.

Not only he, but all Dutch citizens opposed to the “Islamisation” of their country would be on trial, Mr Wilders warned.

“Who will stand up for our culture if I am silenced?” he added.

‘Incitement’

The three judges said that they had weighed Mr Wilders’s “one-sided generalisations” against his right to free speech, and ruled that he had gone beyond the normal leeway granted to politicians.

This is a happy day for all followers of Islam who do not want to be tossed on the garbage dump of Nazism
Gerard Spong, lawyer

“The Amsterdam appeals court has ordered the prosecution of member of parliament Geert Wilders for inciting hatred and discrimination, based on comments by him in various media on Muslims and their beliefs,” the court said in a statement.

“The court also considers appropriate criminal prosecution for insulting Muslim worshippers because of comparisons between Islam and Nazism made by Wilders,” it added.

The court’s ruling reverses a decision last year by the public prosecutor’s office, which said Mr Wilders’s comments had been made outside parliament as a contribution to the debate on Islam in Dutch society and that no criminal offence had been committed.

Prosecutors said on Wednesday that they could not appeal against the judgement and would open an investigation immediately.

Gerard Spong, a prominent lawyer who pushed for Mr Wilders’s prosecution, welcomed the court’s decision.

“This is a happy day for all followers of Islam who do not want to be tossed on the garbage dump of Nazism,” he told reporters.

‘Fascist book’

In March 2008, Mr Winders posted a film about the Koran on the internet, prompting angry protests across the Muslim World.

Anti-Wilders protest in Amsterdam (March 2008)

Opponents say Mr Wilders has been fuelling hate against Muslims

The opening scenes of Fitna – a Koranic term sometimes translated as “strife” – show a copy of the holy book followed by footage of the bomb attacks on the US in 11 September 2001, London in July 2005 and Madrid in March 2004.

Pictures appearing to show Muslim demonstrators holding up placards saying “God bless Hitler” and “Freedom go to hell” also feature.

The film ends with the statement: “Stop Islamisation. Defend our freedom.”

Dutch Prime Minister Jan Peter Balkenende said at the time that the film wrongly equated Islam with violence and served “no purpose other than to offend”.

A year earlier, Mr Wilders described the Koran as a “fascist book” and called for it to be banned in “the same way we ban Mein Kampf”, in a letter published in the De Volkskrant newspaper.

Mr Wilders has had police protection since Dutch director Theo Van Gogh was killed by a radical Islamist in 2004.

Correspondents say his Freedom Party (PVV), which has nine MPs in the lower house of parliament, has built its popularity largely by tapping into the fear and resentment of Muslim immigrants.


END OR BEGINNING?

Whether it’s the End for freedom of speech/thought/inherited culture in the west if Wilders is convicted or the End of fundamentalist rantings if he is found innocent, I have no idea.  On that court judgement will depend what sort of “Beginning” we are in.  The start of more such cases in our courts OR the start of a fightback from native western populaces and law-abiding immigrants?  Again – I have NO idea.

But I believe it IS that important.


DEMOCRACY

‘Our Cognitive Surplus’ MAKES AN IMPORTANT POINT (my bolding):

“Democracy is a good idea, but it needs to come with a big caveat that if you’re not into democracy you’re not welcome to participate. Free markets are a good idea, but they need to come with a big caveat saying that if you’re going to fiddle them you’re not welcome to participate.

Western values have the same problem as the above. Our belief in democracy is so radical that we allow those who don’t believe in democracy to vote. Our belief in being inclusive is so radical that we want to include those who don’t believe in being inclusive. Our belief in free speech is so radical that we want to give free speech to those who want to use it to fight it. Our belief in human rights is so radical that we want to give a suit of rights to people who don’t want to permit others such rights.

This radical application of Western values is potentially self-destructive. It is analogous to having the potential to democratically elect a dictator.”

I couldn’t have put it better myself.


NOW let’s see what the world’s favourite freedom-loving President is made of. Do you think he’ll give a damn? Nor me.


LIST OF SITES CARRYING THE WILDERS CHARGES STORY

You may not agree with ALL the political stances of ALL the below, but that is democracy and freedom for you. In this damning of the attempt to silence Wilders, we are all agreed.

This site Fausta’s Blog has the following links to the story:

I’ll let you know when it appears on a Guardian Cif page. So far it’s only here, at a non-comment page.

wildersspencer2

Geert Wilders and Robert Spencer, 'Jihad Watch' writer

As a prelude to Durban II, a Second Preparatory Session of the 20-state Preparatory Committee — of which Libya has been elected chair with Cuba, Pakistan and Iran as vice-chairs — was held in Geneva from 6 to 17 October 2008. The resulting “Draft Outcome Document for the Durban Review Conference 2009″ is now available on the United Nations Human Rights Council (UNHRC) website at LINK 1.”It is clear from the draft document, as well as from reports emanating from the subsequent 63rd UN General Assembly meeting held in Geneva during the first week of November, that a central focus of Durban II will be “Islamophobia”, which is being presented as “a new form of racism”.

Muslims, the draft declaration asserts, are at dire risk of a racial “holocaust” due to “a new form of racism” — “Islamophobia” — which is incited through “defamation of Islam”.

What race is Islam again?

The draft declaration recommends that local, national and international laws and human rights covenants be reviewed and amended as necessary so that “defamation of Islam” is made a criminal offence, losing the protection it has long enjoyed under the “pretext” of “freedom of expression, counter terrorism or national security”. It recommends that legal instruments be established to punish offenders — that is, those who “defame” Islam by associating it with violence, human rights abuses or terrorism….

I trust, then, that among the first to be prosecuted for “defaming Islam” will be the likes of al-Zawahri, Omar Bakri, Anjem Chaudry, Abu Bakar Bashir, et al.

Also from Jihad Watch, 23rd January, 09 – Muslims walk into Jewish-owned shops and say “I’m going to kill you.”

“Threats to Jews in New York, threats to Jews in London, threats to Jews all over. And yet the UN is focused on “Islamophobia,” and Islamic advocacy groups in the U.S. have to manufacture hate crimes to shore up their victim status. When will this madness end? Is the West even still able to produce a political leader who will stand up to this? The free world needs to take a stand and make it clear to Muslims in the West that this is not tolerable. But I am not holding my breath.”


WILDERS VIDEOS

Fitna The Movie: Geert Wilders’ Film About the Quran (English)



Geert Wilders Defends Anti-Islamic Film Fitna – CBN.com


Back to top

Read transcript of Wilders speech in New York September, 2008


If you’d like to be added to the list of those showing this VERY important development, please contact me. I will not need to publish any comment you send me if you do not wish it to be published.  I’ll just add your website or blog link. Even if we do  not hold all politic views in common – and who does? – we need to know WHO exactly is on the side of freedom.





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21 Responses to “Is This the END or Just the BEGINNING? Geert Wilders charged over Fitna movie”

  1. Grundoon Says:

    Just another in the tortured trail of terror that forces otherwise intelligent people to cower in fear of the Islamacists and their threats. Soon there will be no freedom of speech when it comes to criticism of Muslims, but they will be free to call our women whores, our laws unfair and our western ideals garbage. Welcome to the Brave New World. Orwell was right, he just had the dates wrong.

    • keeptonyblairforpm Says:

      I think this is more, much more than just another of those things we have to put up with as freedom-loving peoples.

      This man seems to be the only voice willing to be heard in Europe on this. The last one – Theo Van Gogh – was murdered by an Islamicist jihadist a few years ago.

      CNN has now covered it.

      Let’s see how much coverage it gets in the mainstream press. I expect the Guardian will be full of it!

      Nor do I expect the BBC to cover it.

  2. Arlene Says:

    This is a perfect opportunity for the medias of the democratic world to unite in standing for free speech. We see attacks against all religions in the free press. You can call Christianity, Mormonism, Catholicism, etc., any vile name you want without fear of being arrested. A few years ago there was a piece of “art” in New York City on public display. It was a sculpture of the Holy Mother Mary carved out of “manure”. No one was prosecuted or even charged for inciting hatred of Catholicism.
    Imagine what would happen if that same sculpture was of Mohammad?
    The double standard stands out like a black eye.
    All free media and every free citizen of every democratic country should unite in defending the “law-given” RIGHT of Geert Wilder to publicize his own opinion. If Wilder is convicted we will all be AFRAID to speak our minds. We will be gagged. If the moderate Muslim population were really interested in abiding by the freedoms they are entitled to in our countries, they should speak up for Wilder. They may not like what he says, but they should agree that he has the RIGHT to say it. Viva la Freedom of the Press! Viva la Freedom of Speech!

  3. keeptonyblairforpm Says:

    Wonder if Melanie Phillips will cover it at The Spectator.

    Freedom of speech is only confined to fanatics. I think this is pertinent to the point, and one I have to tried to make before here:

    “Democracy is a good idea, but it needs to come with a big caveat that if you’re not into democracy you’re not welcome to participate. Free markets are a good idea, but they need to come with a big caveat saying that if you’re going to fiddle them you’re not welcome to participate.

    Western values have the same problem as the above. Our belief in democracy is so radical that we allow those who don’t believe in democracy to vote. Our belief in being inclusive is so radical that we want to include those who don’t believe in being inclusive. Our belief in free speech is so radical that we want to give free speech to those who want to use it to fight it. Our belief in human rights is so radical that we want to give a suit of rights to people who don’t want to permit others such rights. Etc etc

    This radical application of Western values is potentially self-destructive. It is analogous to having the potential to democratically elect a dictator.”

    Democracy, as we know it, is of NO interest to these fanatics who abuse our democracies.

    Tragically the liberal press won’t accept this, as it would mean they had been wrong all along. And politicians KNOW it but are afraid of inciting social unrest OR worse still (!) losing their ethnically supported parliamentary seats.

    It’s a shameful situation.

    And though it pains me to say it, I don’t even think Tony Blair would touch this with a bargepole right now, given his endeavours to bring moderate Muslims onside over the Middle East situation.

    Everyone is SO super-sensitive and some are very near the edge to begin with.

    P.S. Melanie Phillips has it too now. Right here.

  4. Spanish Pundit Says:

    Geert Wilders: las…

    Cuando los nazis vinieron a buscar a los comunistas, guardé silencio, porque yo no era comunista,Cuando encarcelaron a los socialdem ……

  5. keeptonyblairforpm Says:

    Thanks Spanish Pundit,

    I’ve referred to this several times at this site.

    Rough translation of your comment:

    When the Nazis came to look for the Communists, I kept silence, because I was not communist …

  6. Al Qaeda call to attack “criminal” Britain « Tony Blair Says:

    [...] you thought it was ONLY Dutch politician Geert Wilders who was being PERSECUTED/PROSECUTED FOR FREE SPEECH?  Wonder who will be the first British MP to [...]

  7. centurean2 Says:

    Notice how when anyone speaks out against the islamic threat the BBC bang on the tag RIGHT WING.
    When in reality the only really right wing party i see across Europe is in Italy.
    The BBC always failing in their duty to point out that what they term right wing the Nazis, were in reality Socialists.
    Nazi” means “National Socialist German Workers’ NSDAP.
    A great lie that should be faced and uncovered which will prove once and for all just exactly what the BBC have become.

    British MPs Charged? More chance of hell freezing over it takes courage and they haven’t got one ounce!
    The muslim population here is huge therefore their votes mean more.
    The 1.7 MILLION best taken with a large block of salt, or just believe your lying eyes.

    To Silence Geert is to silence us all.
    Later in the spring 2009 the UN intend to bring in what amounts to a sharia law, it being to stop all criticism of islam and muslims.
    Have you noticed how many British Dhimmi MPs have come out against this UN proposal, not one!

    • keeptonyblairforpm Says:

      Hi centurean2,

      The BBC (TV anyway, I don’t think Radio 4 is quite as baised) has lost any claim to impartiality, imho.

      Perhaps you need to approach Michael Cotterell or David Aaronovitch and suggest a TV programme on this. You could call it TRUTH UNCOVERED or something similar. Then they could claim the moral high ground for dissing themselves! I’m sure they’d leap at the chance.

      Yes, my remarks about targeting British MPs and about any of them speaking out were obliquely intended to focus our eyes on the fact that neither of these eventualities is vaguely likely. Not even from the Tories.

      I have long said here at this blog that their silence has more to do with the inner-city ethnic vote than being happy with the present situation. I know this to be the case, from some MPs themselves. They’re running scared. But why on earth does not the Conservative Party speak out? They don’t have many inner city seats to lose.

      Yes I referred to the UN business resolution before, as has Jihad Watch.

      Excerpt:


      “The OIC & the UN: Islamophobia and ‘defamation of religion,’” by Elizabeth Kendal for the WEA, November 15 (thanks to Paul):

      Durban I — the UN’s first World Conference on Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance — which was held in Durban, South Africa, in early September 2001 ended with a walkout over its virulent anti-Semitism. Yet sadly it now seems clear that the Durban Review Conference (or Durban II), which will be held in Geneva in April 2009, is shaping up to be even worse.

      As a prelude to Durban II, a Second Preparatory Session of the 20-state Preparatory Committee — of which Libya has been elected chair with Cuba, Pakistan and Iran as vice-chairs — was held in Geneva from 6 to 17 October 2008. The resulting “Draft Outcome Document for the Durban Review Conference 2009″ is now available on the United Nations Human Rights Council (UNHRC) website at LINK 1.

      It is clear from the draft document, as well as from reports emanating from the subsequent 63rd UN General Assembly meeting held in Geneva during the first week of November, that a central focus of Durban II will be “Islamophobia”, which is being presented as “a new form of racism”.

      Muslims, the draft declaration asserts, are at dire risk of a racial “holocaust” due to “a new form of racism” — “Islamophobia” — which is incited through “defamation of Islam”.

      What race is Islam again?

      It’s time to abolish the UN, if you ask me, and not just for this reason. Fat chance of that while Obama finds his feet and tries to sort out the good guys from the bad.

  8. Today’s Wilders roundup « Defend Geert Wilders Says:

    [...] Tony Blair – is this the end or just the beginning? [...]

  9. USpace Says:

    .
    FREE Partij voor de Vrijheid! The Koran shouldn’t be banned. Mein Kampf isn’t a ‘Holy Book’, but it shouldn’t be banned either, but you should be able to criticize it and the idiots who agree with it.

    As many sane people know, Geert Wilders is NO racist. He is simply against out-of-control immigration; and against immigrants who won’t assimilate; and the ones who beat Gays and rape non-Muslim women for not being covered up. He is also very much against the ones who kill their own daughters and sisters for their ‘family honor’.
    .
    absurd thought –
    God of the Universe says
    don’t criticize religions

    just use Christian words
    substitute for Islam’s words

    .
    here’s an absurd thought -
    your Supreme God knew
    Jesus as a pedophile

    and a raping terrorist
    converting slaves by the sword
    .
    Muslims are not a ‘race’ anyway, they are followers of a religion/ideology and its Sharia Law. Most Muslims aren’t even Arabs, which by the way, is also not a ‘Race’.

    But their duty is, according to their Koran, to spread Sharia law over the whole Earth. It might take 100-200 years, if they succeed.

    Is that the kind of world we want for our great-grand childrens’ great-grand children? A Taliban Planet? I bet not. Muslims are the biggest victims of Islam. Wilders is NOT against Muslims, he is against Islamic Fundamentalism.

    We all should read the Koran, but be careful, for the Koran prohibits non-Muslims from reading it. I wonder why.

    This is BIG, this is REAL BIG! SPREAD THE WORD to the world everyone! The EU Mandarins have crossed the line! If this goes to court, how much more of the public will become aware of this tyranny?
    All real freedom starts with freedom of speech. If there is no freedom of speech, then there can be no real freedom.

    The Christians and Jews don’t riot when somebody makes fun of Christ or Jews. People must learn to be civilized, and held to account when they are not. Muslims included.

    Geert Wilders is a hero spreading the painful truth. He MUST be protected!
    .
    here’s an absurd thought -
    your Supreme God says
    Christians are a race

    who love the Jewish race
    and the peaceful Buddhist race

    .
    absurd thought -
    God of the Universe wants
    Sharia Law for ALL

    submit to glorious life
    slavery and servitude

    .
    absurd thought -
    God of the Universe says
    outlaw self-defense

    exposing violent crimes
    shall be deemed hate speech

    .
    absurd thought -
    God of the Universe says
    decide to change your race

    just simply change religions
    your religion is your race
    .
    All real freedom starts with freedom of speech. Without freedom of speech there can be no real freedom.
    .
    :)
    .

    • keeptonyblairforpm Says:

      Thanks for the comment USpace.

      A lot of thought-worthy stuff there.

      I must confess I did NOT know that non-Muslims were “forbidden” from reading the koran. Do you have a link for that? I like to back up anything I say with an authoritative link – just to separate opinion from fact, y’know – and to be different from some! If this is true, does Mr Blair know this? He is quite a reader of that book.

      I am as yet undecided about Islam. I certainly don’t want it taking any deeper hold here in Britain. Its strictures are antipathetic to our secular society. But I am undecided as to whether or not it is “bad” intrinsically, or just misinterpreted.

      My argument, like yours, is that FREE SPEECH is at risk here, if Wilders is prosecuted successfully. And, if the case is unsuccessful, there is the question of repercussions.

      Well, we in free democracies will just have to work that one out if and when the time comes.

      I know ONE thing. If he loses, those on HIS side are unlikely to scream blue murder in demonstrations. But if he wins – well – look out!

      Is this what the courts are afraid of? Is this why he will likely lose?

      Oh Dhimmi, thy name is Confusion.

  10. USpace Says:

    .
    KTBFPM – I’m sorry, I may be mistaken on that. I thought I had heard that somewhere, but I haven’t yet found anything exactly like that googling around. From what I’ve found so far, I probably should have said something like:

    “We all should read the Koran, but be careful, for some strict Islamists prohibit non-Muslims from having or holding one. Also, it is only ‘official’ in Arabic, and some Muslims say Non-Muslims can’t understand it. I wonder why.”

    But I guess if that line in my comment helps cause some people to investigate Islam more closely, then the misspeak was worth it. Besides, whether Non-Muslims may or may not read the Koran is hardly the worst, most important, or most dangerous question, or feature of Islam.

    Daniel Pipes says we can learn more about Islam from its history than from its texts anyway.

    I am certain that you aren’t “undecided” about whether a “Taliban Planet” would be a good thing or not; but rather “undecided” about whether Islamic conquest is a goal, or a certainty. A goal it is, a certainty it is definitely not. Not if 100s of millions of us have anything to say about it.
    :)

    absurd thought -
    God of the Universe says
    never criticize prophets

    there is no hateful scripture
    claim it can’t be translated
    .

    • keeptonyblairforpm Says:

      Hi USpace,

      I am undecided as to the good or evil of Islam. I give people the benefit of the doubt of course. And since millions of people in this world are devoted and sincere followers of Islam and only think of it in terms of its being a loving religion, I have to take cognisance of that.

      On the other hand perhaps Wilders is right, and Islam is not a good thing.

      Whatever, he has STILL the right to say what he thinks. Only through public debate can we see all the arguments laid out and all the evidence. One of my worries is that the koran seems to forbid debate, change, interpretation, updating, modernising.

      Now THAT concerns me.

      Of course a Taleban planet would not be a good thing. They need to be destroyed and will be providing America and the rest of us (including the rest of my fellow Europeans) keep their nerve, and understand it may be decades.

      The face we are presented with is not one that sits comfortably with those of us in the west who have fought for democracy, separating religion from state.

      The caliphate business is hardly heard these days.

      I once left a very polite comment at a site explaining Islam. I asked could they kindly clarify what status the old caliphate aim held in their modern thinking, as many non-Muslims were still concerned about this.

      I heard nothing back.

      That silence said a lot about their predicament.

      Some daring Muslim needs to do an updated version of the koran and present it to the world via the internet. Similar to the Bible’s King James version.

      Or does a Scot have to do that for them too?!?

      Tony!

      ;0)

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