Comment at end
17th March, 2009
ANDREW BOSTOM – ON JEFF JACOBY, GEERT WILDERS & OTHERS
Why re-invent the wheel?
From time to time I intend to copy or refer to websites of those who are taking a firm stand against (fundamental radical) Islam. The arguments (and links) already exist. Why re-invent the wheel?
Apart from that, I haven’t yet made up my mind as to whether it is Islam itself or just its interpretation that is the issue. Whether the language of Islam is the issue? Whether to believe ‘Islamists’ (“true” Islam, surely?) on the nature of Islam. And whether there is real separation from ‘Islamicists’?
I am in need of more information, but our democratic, freedom-loving government has banned the free flow of information.
A bit like the war in Iraq (just in case we’re WINNING – see here and here and here), our present Prime Minister doesn’t mention fundamental Islam much if at all! Not by name, anyway!
Might it be fear of us realising that about both the above, Blair had been right all along? Or could it be because the public is not yet convinced? Mustn’t upset the voters, Mr Brown.
That’s courage Gordon Brown style for you. So unlike our once dear leader. See Brown meets the Dalai Lama (& the China/Tibet political niceties.)

The Dalai Lama met Brown AWAY from Number 10, so that protesters would not turn up at Downing Street. So courageous of our "great leader" don't you think?

Tony Blair read the koran almost daily from his first days in Downing Street. I DO wish he'd share what he knows about it with the rest of us.
Having said that, I do not insist that The Previous was always right. It seems I am not alone. As far back as 2001 – (yes, he read the Koran then too) – others disagreed with his thoughts on the “tolerance and openness” of Islam. (See “Light For The Last Days, from December 2001.)
So, yes, I’m still puzzled as to what it is that Mr Blair sees as so tolerant and peaceful about the only world “religion” which looks forward to and actually practises the deaths of others, unbeliever and believer alike.
Tony Blair believed in Islam’s tolerance more than 7 years ago, even before the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. So it isn’t a new revelation of his in order to compensate for any anti-Islam impression the Arab world might have got of him after the Middle East wars.
But yes it’s hard to work out the whys and wherefores of this complex religious politician. Hard to order his priorities as HE sees them, and judge how right they will prove in the long term.
For the record I think he was right in both of his Middle East political military ventures.
But on this one – on Islam? If he’s wrong, he has never been this wrong before.
BACK TO THE WRITERS ON ISLAM – SEARCHING FOR THE TRUTH
Some of these writers will have absolutist views against Islam per se. Others only against the Koran or excerpts of it. Some will be concentrating on fundamental Islam’s basic incompatibility with democracy. Others on the question as to whether a ‘political’ religion has any place in a secular world. There is plenty to debate.
I am perfectly willing to use articles defending Islam too, where writers address the seeming contradictions within it as regards modern democratic freedoms. Personally I have far more interest in freedom as encapsulated and represented within democracy than I do in ‘religions’.
The article copied below – Andrew G. Bostom at FrontPageMagazine – also references others’ thoughts on Islam, with the unuttered questions “is fundamental Islam reformable?” AND “is it REALLY a “religion”.
Mr Bostom clearly differs with the Boston Globe’s Jeff Jacoby, whose interview with Geert Wilders on 8th March 2009, can be read here. Bostom also urges a historical comparative perspective on earlier totalitarian doctrines. For instance he equates Islam to Fascism. (See also: Stalinism and Communism)
Bostom doesn’t say it in so many words, but the difference is that none of the above three was at its fundaments a religious political creed as is today’s Islam. True, Hitler’s Nazis used religion to pursue their ideology against one particluar religion, and outlawed atheists as enemies of the state.
Whether Islam can be described as ‘fascist‘ as some contend is still under discussion. See Telegraph, 1st March 2009 article: (“Fascistic” is the right word for Islamic fundamentalism)
In Jacoby’s Q&A session Wilders makes clear that he does not even think of Islam as a religion, but as a political movement.
This kind of extreme view if accepted by the non-Muslim world, could only lead to one thing – an international religious war.
Thus western leaders are keen to avoid even hearing such thoughts uttered, perhaps understandably.
But if our generation of free democrats are afraid to even LOOK at all of these opinions, we need to ask ourselves ‘WHY?’ We may be wrong in this analysis. But if Islam is not put under a microscope NOW – (yes, Islam – no other ‘religion’ seeks world-wide domination and killing of non-Islamists) – there may never come an opportunity for future generations.
Andrew G . Bostom article follows:
Geert Wilders and Totalitarian Islam
By Andrew G. Bostom
FrontPageMagazine.com, Tuesday, March 17, 2009
During a thoughtful, revealing interview with the Boston Globe’s Jeff Jacoby (published March 8, 2009), Dutch Parliamentarian Geert Wilders clearly unnerved the mainstream conservative journalist with this frank characterization of Islam:
I have nothing against the people. I don’t hate Muslims. But Islam is a totalitarian ideology. It rules every aspect of life – economics, family law, whatever. It has religious symbols, it has a God, it has a book – but it’s not a religion. It can be compared with totalitarian ideologies like Communism or fascism. There is no country where Islam is dominant where you have a real democracy, a real separation between church and state. Islam is totally contrary to our values.
Wilders remained steadfast, dismissing Jacoby’s invocation of the hollow, if oft repeated trope “radical Islam is the problem, and moderate Islam is the solution.” This tired mantra—reiterated constantly for the past decade without a scintilla of supportive evidence—is defied by hard polling data from 2006/2007, and their most recent follow-up reported February 25, 2009. Overwhelming Muslim majorities i.e., better than two-thirds (see the weighted average calculated here) of a well-conducted survey of the world’s most significant, and populous Arab and non-Arab Muslim countries, want these hideous, immoderate outcomes: “strict application” of Shari’a, Islamic Law, and a global Caliphate.
Specifically, the World Public Opinion.org/ University of Maryland poll (released February 25, 2009) indicated the following about our erstwhile Muslim ally nations of Egypt and Pakistan: 81% of the Muslims of “moderate” Egypt, the largest Arab Muslim nation, desire a “strict” application of Shari’a, Islamic Law; 76% of the Pakistan’s Muslims—one of the most important, and sizable non-Arab Muslim populations—want this outcome. Furthermore, 70% of Egyptian Muslims and 69% of Pakistani Muslims desire the re-creation of a “…single Islamic state or Caliphate.” Earlier, I detailed the totalitarian impact of these fulfilled Islamic desires —based upon their doctrinal and historical application, across space and time.
The tenaciously held pieties of Mr. Jacoby and his ilk notwithstanding, Wilders’ keen, if blunt conceptions articulate contemporary realities irrefragably, while re-stating seminal insights on Islam observed by great scholars whose works antedate the present day morbid affliction of cultural relativism.
Jacob Burckhardt (d. 1897), an iconic figure in the annals of Western historiography, believed it was the solemn duty of Western civilization’s heirs to study and acknowledge their own unique cultural inheritance—starting with the culture and heritage of classical Athens. Burckhardt emphasized how the Western conception of freedom was engendered in Athens, where its flowering was accompanied by the production of some of history’s most sublime literary and artistic works. Moreover, while Burckhardt affirmed the irreducible nature of freedom, and upheld equality before the law, he decried the notion—a pervasive, rigidly enforced dogma at present—that all ways of life, opinions, and beliefs were of equal value. Burckhardt argued that this conceptual reductio ad absurdum would destroy Western culture, heralding a return to barbarism. And contra the Western legacy of Athens—epitomized by freedom—Burckhardt referred to Islam as a despotic, or in 20th century parlance, totalitarian ideology.
All religions are exclusive, but Islam is quite notably so, and immediately it developed into a state which seemed to be all of a piece with the religion. The Koran is its spiritual and secular book of law. Its statutes embrace all areas of life…and remain set and rigid; the very narrow Arab mind imposes this nature on many nationalities and thus remolds them for all time (a profound, extensive spiritual bondage!) This is the power of Islam in itself. At the same time, the form of the world empire as well as of the states gradually detaching themselves from it cannot be anything but a despotic monarchy. The very reason and excuse for existence, the holy war, and the possible world conquest, do not brook any other form.
The strongest proof of real, extremely despotic power in Islam is the fact that it has been able to invalidate, in such large measure, the entire history (customs, religion, previous way of looking at things, earlier imagination) of the peoples converted to it. It accomplished this only by instilling into them a new religious arrogance which was stronger than everything and induced them to be ashamed [emphasis in original] of their past
G.H. Bousquet (d. 1978), one of the foremost 20th century scholars of Islamic Law, explained how Islam’s unique institution of jihad war, and its eternal quest to impose the Shari’a on all of humanity, represented the quintessence of Islamic totalitarianism. Writing in 1950, Bousquet further warned that these ancient Muslim doctrines remained alive, and relevant to the modern era.
Islam first came before the world as a doubly totalitarian system. It claimed to impose itself on the whole world and it claimed also, by the divinely appointed Muhammadan law, by the principles of fiqh, to regulate down to the smallest details the whole life of the Islamic community and of every individual believer…Viewed from this angle, the study of Muhammadan Law (dry and forbidding though it may appear to be to those who confine themselves to the indispensable study of the fiqh), is of great importance to the world of today.
Robert Conquest, in the Preface to the 40th Anniversary Edition of The Great Terror, his seminal indictment of Soviet Communist state tyranny under Stalin, observed:
One of the strangest notions put forward about Stalinism [substitute Islamic Jihadism] is that, in the interests of “objectivity” we must be—wait for it—“non-judgmental.” But to ignore, or downplay, the realities of Soviet [substitute Islamic] history is itself a judgment, and a very misleading one. Let me conclude with Patrick Henry saying in 1775, “I know no way of judging of the future but by the past.” The corollary is that misreading of the past incapacitates us as regards our understanding of the future—and of the present too.
I have indicated above, in brackets, where one could readily substitute Jihadism for Stalinism, and Islamic for Soviet.
This past August (2008), in commemoration of Solzhenitsyn’s passing, Roger Kimball described the following anecdote related by Kingsley Amis, about the reception of Professor Conquest’s landmark study, which “for many years,” was “ignored where possible or dismissed as propaganda.” As Amis notes,
Then, in 1988, favorable references to it began to appear in the Soviet media. . . . [A]n American publisher suggested a new edition of the book. “What about a new title Bob? We won’t pretend it’s a new book, but a new title would be good. . . .Bob answered in terms that get a lot of his character into small compass. “Well, perhaps, I Told You So, You Fucking Fools. How’s that?”
Geert Wilders, alone among contemporary political leaders, stands on the shoulders of intellectually honest Western scholars such as Burckhardt, Bousquet, and Conquest, unabashedly addressing contemporary Islam, and the scourge of resurgent jihadism its mainstream religio-political leadership actively promotes. Wilders pellucid, uncompromised views on the threat of totalitarian Islam might be expressed in this formulation,
Islam is the problem; radical reform is the solution.
Let us hope Wilders moral clarity and wisdom counteracts what Robert Conquest described as “…the credulity of supposed intellectual elites,” who misunderstood and misrepresented Soviet totalitarianism, making, “…the pursuit of rational foreign policy difficult.” As Conquest underscored, aptly,
It hardly needs saying that we must do our best to avoid, or prevent, anything resembling a repetition—in fact that the lesson should be learned.
Tags: Andrew Bostom, Andrew G . Bostom totalitarian Islam, Geert Wilders, Gordon Brown, Islam, Jeff Jacoby, Jeff Jacoby interviews Geert Wilders, Tony Blair, Wilders says Islam is not a religion
March 21, 2009 at 12:21 am |
[...] See Part 1 ‘Analysing Islam’ Bostom/Jacoby/Wilders [...]
August 3, 2009 at 3:06 pm |
Of course Wilders’ notion that Islam is totally monolithic would be gainsaid by anyone who knows many British muslims, let alone anyone who surveys the religion worldwide.
He is quite rightly excluded, not from expression of his views here, which couldn’t be done of course, but from entering the country.
If he, or various other racists were to turn up with their high profiles we can be quite sure that there would be demonstrations in favour and against, which would be likely to become violent.
Further it seems reasonable for Gordon Brown to meet the Dalai lama and there is no good reason to use such a meeting to throw down a glove to the Chinese. Indeed the Llama has very often sought not to take so challenging a line himself, being more interested in progress than gestures.
I first took a pro Tibet view in about 1960. No longer 11 I do not recommend a war of liberation, indeed there are good arguments that Chinese dominion over what many would regard as a part of China, has brought benefits to what was a feudal society.
August 3, 2009 at 3:31 pm
I have to disagree with you, this time, on at least some of the above, QZ.
YOU are referring to ordinary, everyday non-fundamentalist Muslims – the sort we both know and love. Wilders is referring to Islam as SHE is WROTE, or as he interprets is as she is wrote. That may be different from YOUR interpretation, but we should all be entitled to our freedom of opinion AND freedom of expression of that opinion. If not, we all become banner-waving, slogan-shouting “kill the cartoonists” idiots!
Wilders’ appearance in Italy and the USA caused NO riots! Wonder why we native Brits are such a riotous mob (NOT!)
NO-ONE but NO-ONE should be excluded from our land while raging and racist lunatics and fundamentalists are allowed to enter under any guise. And many homegrown varieties are NOT being dealt with. (As the anti-Blair types say – WE ALL KNOW that.)
There’s Anjem Choudary, for a start! AND his cohorts who meet weekly in North London to brainwash the gullible. There’s Hizb ut-Tahrir, HQ’d in London, whose aim is stated openly – to establish A MONOLITHIC world-wide caliphate. They have been appearing in a city near you in recent months doing Allah’s work!
You sound very much like Stan here, QZ. And he and I, though we agree on much else, do NOT agree on this.
Must be my lack of political socalist background.
As for the Dalai Llama, Tibet and China – you’re probably right.
August 3, 2009 at 4:33 pm |
Sorry Blair Friend, but you are mistaken. Contrary to the wishes of Tory right wingers like Daniel Hannan MEP it seems to me most unlikely that any sane non formerly socialist Home Secretary would vary from my own.
Chameleon has not yet announced that he would seek to abandon the Race Discrimination Act, and the Uk has long excluded people who incite violence, or might be thought to do so.
Italy is another country, and they have been pretty cowardly when it comes to taking up their share of responsibility vis a vis Islamo-fascists I recall. No wonder they permit right wing racists, who make out that the Koran is proof that Islam is a declaration of war on us all the right to enter their country.
In Italy Communists and Fascists are used to having their ways, regardless of the results. I see no need to ape their preferences.
The judgement that Wilders’ presence would be likely to incite violence may be mistaken, it is certainly not wrong.
August 3, 2009 at 4:59 pm
QZ – can’t quite get my head around this bit:
Who? What?
Sorry QZ but you are wrong, particularly on Wilders. He does not and never HAS incited violence. He has complained about it when it was meted out to his countrymen, including high profile people like the film director Theo Van Gogh and politician Pim Fortuyn. He didn’t take too kindly to them being murdered in the streets of Amsterdam by Islamist fundamentalists. Can’t imagine why that bothered him.
As for Italy – you give the same reply that Stan gave to me here previously. The point is proven by your own words IF you are right on Italy, and I don’t accept you are right (must be a Labour party line you two have swallowed hook, line and sinker.)
Your own words have clarified the reality – even if Italy is unbalanced in its approach to moderate Muslims, there still was NO riot when Wilders appeared there.
A little bit of semantics in your last sentence, perhaps?
I think Wilders ban was a wrong decision because it was made for the wrong reasons. You only have to see how a balance was attempted to be set up in the compilation of the LIST of banned people which included the American shock-jock to see that there is more at play than reflecting reality. Keeping Muslim voters onside is all important.
FREE speech is given to those who wish to hang OUR politicians, but not to those who wish to point out the creeping reality of a foreign invading culture, monolithic as it is AT THE TOP.
We won’t agree on this, QZ.
Stan and I had to call a halt to the conversation, last time, when that became clear.
August 3, 2009 at 6:03 pm |
His views are not blocked from being expressed here, so it is not really a freedom of speech issue as the Tory extremists like Daniel Hannan say. His presence is not welcome because he would clearly incite violence from both sides. In Italy it is not quite the same issue for their extremists, and that is key.
Islam is not monolithic at the top of course, no one living person tells them what Sharia is for example, and sharia has different roles in different places. (Not arguing in favour, just pointing out that islam is varied and multifarious)
Daniel Hannan MEP was the MEP who managed to get to harangue Gordon Brown when he visited the Euro-Parliament a while back, and his YouTube vid of that was much watched, largely by US conservatives, very upset at losing their Presidential election. He is charming, and has a Dully Tele blog. Also hates the NHS & etc – very right wing agenda. Try GoFourth for a clip of his objections to the NHS. He was a champion of Wilders of course.
August 3, 2009 at 6:58 pm
It is certainly a freedom of listening to and of association issue! And all Wilders was doing was talking to some members of The Lords. He had no grand tour or other speaking engagements to attend. I think it is atrocious to ban someone like this. And now he is a powerful MEP. Must have been saying something right.
QZ, do we have to fall into the accusatory mode so loved by those who hate Blair, Brown & Labour? You describe Hannan as a “Tory extremist” now?! I personally am not particularly drawn to this guy despite his communicaions skills. Ditto Obama.
But Toryism today is Blairism.
The EU parliament is a whole different world from Cameron’s world, and he knows it as does Hannan. I saw the Hannan video and I could see why it attracted so many people. The EU is still the Tory faultine. They may even be defeated on this, if Mandelson plays it right. (Oh and Blair.)
Brown? He still doesn’t seem to know quite what to do about the EU. When did he last say what our relationship should be to the rest of Europe? When did he EVER say anything about that? He only suggests that HE has the answer adopted by Europe to our economic travails. Even though France an dGermany don;t agree with him. He says nothing else on Europe.
Brown still thinks he is the chancellor of the exchequer. He’s not alone. So do I.
As for the sharia business – yes you are right that no one person tells them how extreme their form of sharia needs to be. But how ANY person of the left or centre left in this country can argue that the lack of one leading hand at the top – where such diversity of interpretation is widespread as the world knows to its cost – how any Labour party moderate free thinker can argue that this is a PLUS escapes me. All it does is leave local groups to decide for themselves as to whether a lashing, limb-chopping, or execution is the requisite punishment.
For me it is sufficient that women and girls are worth half of a man’s worth under sharia and are clearly thus regarded as half human. I’ll never put up with that.
And it looks like Brown knows when to keep quiet on issues of the treatment of women. As with Wilders – when VOTES are in it!
This woman in Sudan is to be flogged for wearing trousers. France has complained about it. How about the rest of Europe? How about Britain?
MR BROWN!!!!!!!!!!?????????
MR MILIBAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??????????????
MS HARMAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!????????????????????????????????